Need advice on stubborn engine codes
#11
09-18-2012, 03:48 PM
Hi, Kennin,
Well good news to report! I did the job over the weekend - took me about 8 hours total. Found the middle tee broken right in two - looks like it was melted. Replaced all 3 tees with brass ones, and replaced most of the hoses. Drove about 200 miles so far, no engine codes!
I've got a couple issues/questions I wanted to mention:
1. I replaced 3 of the 6 spark plugs - the easy ones in front. However, there was a lot of oil in there, especially the left one. Is this anything to overly worry about? What could be the cause? I do burn a little oil in the mornings, but only wind up putting about a quart in between oil changes.
2. How on earth does one change the rear sparks? I could barely reach the damn things even with the whole air system removed. I gave up b/c I was too tired. Is there any trick to this?
3. I seem to have one vacuum hose that is not attached to anything. It's the one that comes off the right-most tee, and hangs down alongside the air cleaner. Any idea where that goes? On the vacuum hose routing diagram, it's the lower-most hose coming off the tee, just below the EGR Solenoid valve.
4. I wound up breaking a bolt when re-attaching the air charging component - it happened because some of the gasket maker flowed into the bolt hole, so that the torque wrench kept turning too easily. I was able to extract the whole bolt - but how do you prevent this from happening? The same thing happened on other bolts, but they did not break.
I want to say 'thanks' for the great advice - I think I saved a lot of dough on this one, and learned a lot too.
Paul
Well good news to report! I did the job over the weekend - took me about 8 hours total. Found the middle tee broken right in two - looks like it was melted. Replaced all 3 tees with brass ones, and replaced most of the hoses. Drove about 200 miles so far, no engine codes!
I've got a couple issues/questions I wanted to mention:
1. I replaced 3 of the 6 spark plugs - the easy ones in front. However, there was a lot of oil in there, especially the left one. Is this anything to overly worry about? What could be the cause? I do burn a little oil in the mornings, but only wind up putting about a quart in between oil changes.
2. How on earth does one change the rear sparks? I could barely reach the damn things even with the whole air system removed. I gave up b/c I was too tired. Is there any trick to this?
3. I seem to have one vacuum hose that is not attached to anything. It's the one that comes off the right-most tee, and hangs down alongside the air cleaner. Any idea where that goes? On the vacuum hose routing diagram, it's the lower-most hose coming off the tee, just below the EGR Solenoid valve.
4. I wound up breaking a bolt when re-attaching the air charging component - it happened because some of the gasket maker flowed into the bolt hole, so that the torque wrench kept turning too easily. I was able to extract the whole bolt - but how do you prevent this from happening? The same thing happened on other bolts, but they did not break.
I want to say 'thanks' for the great advice - I think I saved a lot of dough on this one, and learned a lot too.
Paul
#12
09-18-2012, 06:46 PM
Hi, Kennin,
Well good news to report! I did the job over the weekend - took me about 8 hours total. Found the middle tee broken right in two - looks like it was melted. Replaced all 3 tees with brass ones, and replaced most of the hoses. Drove about 200 miles so far, no engine codes!
I've got a couple issues/questions I wanted to mention:
1. I replaced 3 of the 6 spark plugs - the easy ones in front. However, there was a lot of oil in there, especially the left one. Is this anything to overly worry about? What could be the cause? I do burn a little oil in the mornings, but only wind up putting about a quart in between oil changes.
common problem. valve gaskets are shot. this is a big job, the intake has to be removed. you will need the gaskets, the half moons, and all the little grommets for the bolts. also, a set of intake gaskets, or you can reuse you old ones, if you coat them with a sealant. here is what i do-take a plug socket, and keep dipping it on the plug, remove, wipe off excess oil, repeat till very little oil, then pull the plug, and clean it further. if you pull the plug with oil in the well, it will all go down thru the plug hole. now you clean the crap out of the well, use lots of rags and brake cleaner, get it spotless. then take some sealant, like hylomar, and wipe it inside the well, make sure to get it all around the valve cover gasket, you can easily feel where it is. let it dry, reinstall the plug, and if you did a good job, it will not leak. the rear bank will be worse
2. How on earth does one change the rear sparks? I could barely reach the damn things even with the whole air system removed. I gave up b/c I was too tired. Is there any trick to this?
no trick, but a lot of stuff has to come off. there is a tutorial on the other millenia group. the hardest for me is the connector to the coil on #5. i pull the rear intercooler to get to this. BUT, to get to the rear ic, you need to pull the battery, move the wire harness, yada, yada. some people can get the connector off/on without pulling the ic, i cannot.
3. I seem to have one vacuum hose that is not attached to anything. It's the one that comes off the right-most tee, and hangs down alongside the air cleaner. Any idea where that goes? On the vacuum hose routing diagram, it's the lower-most hose coming off the tee, just below the EGR Solenoid valve.
dunno. i can go look, but i have been working a lot lately, and i just come home and crap out on the couch. perhaps someone else here or on the other group is more motivated.
4. I wound up breaking a bolt when re-attaching the air charging component - it happened because some of the gasket maker flowed into the bolt hole, so that the torque wrench kept turning too easily. I was able to extract the whole bolt - but how do you prevent this from happening? The same thing happened on other bolts, but they did not break.
anytime you work with threads in aluminum, you gotta be careful. if you look at the bolts mazda uses, the first 3-4mm is smooth, kind of a starter. also, aluminum gets corrosion, perhaps "chasing" the threads with a tap or die will help
I want to say 'thanks' for the great advice - I think I saved a lot of dough on this one, and learned a lot too.
Paul
Well good news to report! I did the job over the weekend - took me about 8 hours total. Found the middle tee broken right in two - looks like it was melted. Replaced all 3 tees with brass ones, and replaced most of the hoses. Drove about 200 miles so far, no engine codes!
I've got a couple issues/questions I wanted to mention:
1. I replaced 3 of the 6 spark plugs - the easy ones in front. However, there was a lot of oil in there, especially the left one. Is this anything to overly worry about? What could be the cause? I do burn a little oil in the mornings, but only wind up putting about a quart in between oil changes.
common problem. valve gaskets are shot. this is a big job, the intake has to be removed. you will need the gaskets, the half moons, and all the little grommets for the bolts. also, a set of intake gaskets, or you can reuse you old ones, if you coat them with a sealant. here is what i do-take a plug socket, and keep dipping it on the plug, remove, wipe off excess oil, repeat till very little oil, then pull the plug, and clean it further. if you pull the plug with oil in the well, it will all go down thru the plug hole. now you clean the crap out of the well, use lots of rags and brake cleaner, get it spotless. then take some sealant, like hylomar, and wipe it inside the well, make sure to get it all around the valve cover gasket, you can easily feel where it is. let it dry, reinstall the plug, and if you did a good job, it will not leak. the rear bank will be worse
2. How on earth does one change the rear sparks? I could barely reach the damn things even with the whole air system removed. I gave up b/c I was too tired. Is there any trick to this?
no trick, but a lot of stuff has to come off. there is a tutorial on the other millenia group. the hardest for me is the connector to the coil on #5. i pull the rear intercooler to get to this. BUT, to get to the rear ic, you need to pull the battery, move the wire harness, yada, yada. some people can get the connector off/on without pulling the ic, i cannot.
3. I seem to have one vacuum hose that is not attached to anything. It's the one that comes off the right-most tee, and hangs down alongside the air cleaner. Any idea where that goes? On the vacuum hose routing diagram, it's the lower-most hose coming off the tee, just below the EGR Solenoid valve.
dunno. i can go look, but i have been working a lot lately, and i just come home and crap out on the couch. perhaps someone else here or on the other group is more motivated.
4. I wound up breaking a bolt when re-attaching the air charging component - it happened because some of the gasket maker flowed into the bolt hole, so that the torque wrench kept turning too easily. I was able to extract the whole bolt - but how do you prevent this from happening? The same thing happened on other bolts, but they did not break.
anytime you work with threads in aluminum, you gotta be careful. if you look at the bolts mazda uses, the first 3-4mm is smooth, kind of a starter. also, aluminum gets corrosion, perhaps "chasing" the threads with a tap or die will help
I want to say 'thanks' for the great advice - I think I saved a lot of dough on this one, and learned a lot too.
Paul
#13
10-10-2012, 10:54 AM
Hello.
More sordid news to report: I thought I had fixed the issue when I found the broken tee - so I only replaced about 1/2 of the hoses. Well, 150 miles later I got the 1170/1173 errors again (H02S Front, left and right). So, I figured, let's do the rest of the hoses. I went in and did the whole thing again, this time replacing the rest of the hoses. Everything looked great. Now, within 10 minutes of driving, I get error P1540 - ABV Control System Malfunction, TC Off indicator lights, and the car starts bucking and won't go over 35 mph. Before the 10 minutes, it runs great. I figure I must have screwed something up when replacing the rest of the hoses; either mixed something up, or kinked or squashed something. This weekend I plan to take everything apart again, and retrace all the hoses again. BUT, if anyone has any idea where I should concentrate, based on the error and symptoms, please let me know! I figure it must be that area where the ABV solenoid is. It's very hard to see that stuff.
Thanks!
Paul
More sordid news to report: I thought I had fixed the issue when I found the broken tee - so I only replaced about 1/2 of the hoses. Well, 150 miles later I got the 1170/1173 errors again (H02S Front, left and right). So, I figured, let's do the rest of the hoses. I went in and did the whole thing again, this time replacing the rest of the hoses. Everything looked great. Now, within 10 minutes of driving, I get error P1540 - ABV Control System Malfunction, TC Off indicator lights, and the car starts bucking and won't go over 35 mph. Before the 10 minutes, it runs great. I figure I must have screwed something up when replacing the rest of the hoses; either mixed something up, or kinked or squashed something. This weekend I plan to take everything apart again, and retrace all the hoses again. BUT, if anyone has any idea where I should concentrate, based on the error and symptoms, please let me know! I figure it must be that area where the ABV solenoid is. It's very hard to see that stuff.
Thanks!
Paul
#14
10-10-2012, 09:09 PM
Hello.
More sordid news to report: I thought I had fixed the issue when I found the broken tee - so I only replaced about 1/2 of the hoses. Well, 150 miles later I got the 1170/1173 errors again (H02S Front, left and right). So, I figured, let's do the rest of the hoses. I went in and did the whole thing again, this time replacing the rest of the hoses. Everything looked great. Now, within 10 minutes of driving, I get error P1540 - ABV Control System Malfunction, TC Off indicator lights, and the car starts bucking and won't go over 35 mph. Before the 10 minutes, it runs great. I figure I must have screwed something up when replacing the rest of the hoses; either mixed something up, or kinked or squashed something. This weekend I plan to take everything apart again, and retrace all the hoses again. BUT, if anyone has any idea where I should concentrate, based on the error and symptoms, please let me know! I figure it must be that area where the ABV solenoid is. It's very hard to see that stuff.
Thanks!
Paul
More sordid news to report: I thought I had fixed the issue when I found the broken tee - so I only replaced about 1/2 of the hoses. Well, 150 miles later I got the 1170/1173 errors again (H02S Front, left and right). So, I figured, let's do the rest of the hoses. I went in and did the whole thing again, this time replacing the rest of the hoses. Everything looked great. Now, within 10 minutes of driving, I get error P1540 - ABV Control System Malfunction, TC Off indicator lights, and the car starts bucking and won't go over 35 mph. Before the 10 minutes, it runs great. I figure I must have screwed something up when replacing the rest of the hoses; either mixed something up, or kinked or squashed something. This weekend I plan to take everything apart again, and retrace all the hoses again. BUT, if anyone has any idea where I should concentrate, based on the error and symptoms, please let me know! I figure it must be that area where the ABV solenoid is. It's very hard to see that stuff.
Thanks!
Paul
kj02-18-741A are them. they are easy to change, but the first time it will be a bit of a puzzle.
#15
10-13-2012, 08:59 PM
Hi,
Well, I took the whole intake system apart again, rechecked all the vacuum lines to make sure they are all connected properly, and they are. I removed the ABV valves and ohm'd them, and they both gave me 32-33, so I think they are probably good. I put everything back carefully, took it out for a test drive, and BAM, 10 minutes later, TCS ON, limp home. I think it's suspicious that this error started after I replaced all the hoses, but everything looks fine to me - no hoses mis-connected, kinked or squashed. Do you have any other ideas of things I should check? This is getting very frustrating.
I appreciate the help!
Paul
Well, I took the whole intake system apart again, rechecked all the vacuum lines to make sure they are all connected properly, and they are. I removed the ABV valves and ohm'd them, and they both gave me 32-33, so I think they are probably good. I put everything back carefully, took it out for a test drive, and BAM, 10 minutes later, TCS ON, limp home. I think it's suspicious that this error started after I replaced all the hoses, but everything looks fine to me - no hoses mis-connected, kinked or squashed. Do you have any other ideas of things I should check? This is getting very frustrating.
I appreciate the help!
Paul
#16
10-14-2012, 08:10 AM
Hi,
Well, I took the whole intake system apart again, rechecked all the vacuum lines to make sure they are all connected properly, and they are. I removed the ABV valves and ohm'd them, and they both gave me 32-33, so I think they are probably good. I put everything back carefully, took it out for a test drive, and BAM, 10 minutes later, TCS ON, limp home. I think it's suspicious that this error started after I replaced all the hoses, but everything looks fine to me - no hoses mis-connected, kinked or squashed. Do you have any other ideas of things I should check? This is getting very frustrating.
I appreciate the help!
Paul
Well, I took the whole intake system apart again, rechecked all the vacuum lines to make sure they are all connected properly, and they are. I removed the ABV valves and ohm'd them, and they both gave me 32-33, so I think they are probably good. I put everything back carefully, took it out for a test drive, and BAM, 10 minutes later, TCS ON, limp home. I think it's suspicious that this error started after I replaced all the hoses, but everything looks fine to me - no hoses mis-connected, kinked or squashed. Do you have any other ideas of things I should check? This is getting very frustrating.
I appreciate the help!
Paul
Well the Millenia was driven another 200 miles today, the check-engine light is still off, and the scan tool indicates that all OBDII monitors (that are not "N/A") are "OK"! Before the trip I mounted the solenoid valves on the metal thing, changed a green & white check-valve that squeaked when I tested it, changed the the PRC solenoid valve, and put a few more clamps on vacuum lines where they were easy to reach (though my silicone lines fit so tight it's probably not necessary).
Upon testing, I determined that the PRC Solenoid Valve (stamped K5T49090 FS05), CAC Bypass Solenoid Valve (stamped K5T49091 KL01), and MAP Solenoid Valve (stamped K5T49096 BP4Y) are interchangeable. It turned out that the best junk-yard replacements I got (both about 38.5 ohms) were a MAP one and a CAC one. The MAP valve had some oil dripping out, though, and though I sprayed some solvent in it and blew it out which seemed to make the airflow normal again, I used the CAC bypass solenoid valve for my PRC solenoid valve replacement, except for the valve's air filter, since the old PRC valve's filter stayed on better (when used as a CAC and MAP the filter goes on the metal port, which is larger than the plastic port A where it goes when used as a PRC solenoid valve). Here is a word description based on "2001 - Millenia - Workshop Manual - Engine":
Labels: orient the solenoid valve so it's resting on the clip with the two-port end on the left and the electrical connector on the right. Port A points left; Port B points up; Port C points right. Electrical Terminal B is closest to you; Terminal A is farthest.
Step 1: Short the terminals together (actually just leaving them disconnected is fine). There should be air flow between ports B and C and no air flow between ports A and B nor between ports A and C.
Step 2: Connect 12V to terminal A and ground to terminal B. There should be air flow between ports A and B and no air flow between ports A and C nor between ports B and C.
Also, for anyone reading this that needs to measure the resistance of their solenoid valves (I mentioned it above, but in case you missed it) there's a 6-pin connector you can undo and measure the resistance of 5 of them. The Red/Black wire is the positive and it is common to all the solenoids. Put a pair of straight pins or small stiff wires in the appropriate female pins to make contact and measure the ohms. Or touch the them with a battery to apply voltage and make sure you hear a click. This also tests that there's no broken wire in the last leg of the wiring. Until I started tracing the wires, I didn't realize this convenient location for testing 5 of the most hard-to-reach solenoid valves existed.
Thanks everyone who helped me get this fixed ! I learned a lot and obtained enough information to delve into some other possible causes of P1526, such as bad wiring. Fortunately my wiring was fine after all. And if vacuum hoses weren't fine at the start, they are now!
these solenoids are a big problem with the 2.3. it is only a matter of time before they go
#17
10-21-2012, 09:43 AM
Hi, Keninn,
Well, no luck - I really had a good feeling about it, but it was not to be. I replaced BOTH ABV solenoids w/ brand new Mazda-brand ones, which I got from Tasca. (BTW, the new ones measured a resistance of exactly the same as the original ones - 32/33). I am about ready to give up.
Any other things I could try before throwing in the towel? I've put so many hours into this it's hard to give up on it.
Thanks again,
Paul
Well, no luck - I really had a good feeling about it, but it was not to be. I replaced BOTH ABV solenoids w/ brand new Mazda-brand ones, which I got from Tasca. (BTW, the new ones measured a resistance of exactly the same as the original ones - 32/33). I am about ready to give up.
Any other things I could try before throwing in the towel? I've put so many hours into this it's hard to give up on it.
Thanks again,
Paul
#18
10-21-2012, 07:59 PM
the only other problem i had with similar symptoms was a bad fuel injector. however, with the car, i also got a 0305 code. same problem, start and run fine for about 10 min, then limp home mode(cut out above 2500, flashing cel, tcs off/tcs lite on). i first changed the plugs and the #5 coil, but it still happened. ohm'd the injectors, and sure enough, #5 showed bad. you can ohm the injectors by unplugging the connector to the rail, and tapping the spade leads. the other millenia group has the sequence, look for a post by yel-low. i was fortunate to find a set of injectors and rails on ebay, and i swapped the 1-3-5 rail, and it has been running good ever since. i took a chance that the used set were not stuck, if injectors sit for a long time, they can stick. also, the injector seals were not changed, and they are pricey, about 12 bucks each. the pcm(primary control module) and the tcm(transmission control module) are separate. if pcm detects a certain problem, it will then cause tcm to go limp home. pcm is really **** about problems with boost. i have seen at least one other person with bad injector problem, and, like you, went thru all the normal stuff before trying the injector. just pull the connector, and ohm it, takes only a few minutes, but i dont have the sequence. if you go to the other site, in the tech section, there is a post by yel-low on how to diagnose a bad injector. it is for a 2.5, but the connections are the same
Last edited by keninn; 10-21-2012 at 08:06 PM.
#19
10-22-2012, 09:29 PM
Just a tip for those rear spark plugs that are a bitch to get to. First thing I would do is change all the factory phillips head screws holding the coils to socket head screws (the ones that use and allen wrench). Then I bought a set of 3/8 drive, long allen head drives. Preferably with the ball end. This makes accessing those screws a lot easier. Of course you need a full complement of all lengths of 3/8" wobble extensions. I also changed the hose clamps on the big vacuum hose that crosses above the spark plugs to screw style, makes them a lot easier to access. With these changes I can now change all 6 plugs in about a hour.
#20
10-24-2012, 04:31 PM
the only other problem i had with similar symptoms was a bad fuel injector. however, with the car, i also got a 0305 code. same problem, start and run fine for about 10 min, then limp home mode(cut out above 2500, flashing cel, tcs off/tcs lite on). i first changed the plugs and the #5 coil, but it still happened. ohm'd the injectors, and sure enough, #5 showed bad. you can ohm the injectors by unplugging the connector to the rail, and tapping the spade leads. the other millenia group has the sequence, look for a post by yel-low. i was fortunate to find a set of injectors and rails on ebay, and i swapped the 1-3-5 rail, and it has been running good ever since. i took a chance that the used set were not stuck, if injectors sit for a long time, they can stick. also, the injector seals were not changed, and they are pricey, about 12 bucks each. the pcm(primary control module) and the tcm(transmission control module) are separate. if pcm detects a certain problem, it will then cause tcm to go limp home. pcm is really **** about problems with boost. i have seen at least one other person with bad injector problem, and, like you, went thru all the normal stuff before trying the injector. just pull the connector, and ohm it, takes only a few minutes, but i dont have the sequence. if you go to the other site, in the tech section, there is a post by yel-low on how to diagnose a bad injector. it is for a 2.5, but the connections are the same
Oh, and triomella, thanks for the advice on getting to those stubborn back plugs - great ideas.
Thanks,
Paul