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1997 Protege, poor acceleration at low rpms. Please help.

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  #1  
Old 10-11-2012, 09:08 PM
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Default 1997 Protege, poor acceleration at low rpms. Please help.

UPDATE:

I found a problem, and maybe THE problem. Here it is.
Top is same on cylinder 1, 2, and 4. Bottom is cylinder 3. I smashed the plug electrodes close together since the spark is so weak and it runs way better. No more misfire and has low rpm power again. It still runs odd though but maybe if I get THIS problem fixed it will solve everything. Any suggestions?? It won't let me resize pic sorry.



http://imageshack.us/a/img21/9649/sparkdifference.jpg



I have a 1997 Mazda Protege, 1.5 Liter, 5 speed. I have posted here before and thought the problem was fixed by adjusting the new TPS. It helped but has not solved my issue.

Symptom:

Engine bogs/hesisitates badly at low RPM, and sometimes high RPM.
I have a 5 speed. When I press the gas to go in any gear, it's like I'm letting off the gas. The second I let off the gas, the car stops stalling.

If I FLOOR it, it does the same thing, giving it more gas pedal makes no difference, not even WOT.

Exact description:
Take off from dead stop (idles fine except surges and drops sometimes, never has an issue starting up either). Car loses all power to accelerate (will cause me to get in a wreck if trying to cross highway fast).

If I let off gas and repress it, it will "catch up" and sometimes go.
If I hold it it will clear up as the engine rpms climb.

If I get it rolling and shift to where the next gear lands 2500 rpm or higher (keeping the rpms high), the car seems to never stall/hesitate/bog.

** If I cycle power to the ignition during the "bog" phase it immediately takes off and regains all power!!!! ** however if it doesn't have enough time to climb rpms, it doesn't catch up and goes back to bogging. It's like cycling ignition resets something for a few seconds and gives me a clean perfect running vehicle.

Any suggestions would be awesome.

What Ive done:

Cleaned EGR and checked the coils. It IS 100% functional. Cleaning it did help somewhat. Cleaned MAF, it seems fine. Repaired exhaust. Replaced TPS and adjusted per instructions I found on the web.

OBD II codes:
It gave an idle air control code (but it was cause I turned the air adjustment screw, and it went away after I turned it back)
It gave a bank 1 02 code but that was due to an exhaust leak that has been fixed now.
It has returned with a light but I haven't had the chance to check the code yet.

This problem has existed way before any lights ever came on!!!!

fuel pump has never been changed but would it cause this? Costly?
don't know where the evap is or how to check it, I believe its near the gas tank.

Oh and I did spray the throttle body the day I cleaned the EGR, and for a while it seemed to run WAY WAY BETTER. Like no bogging. Could something in the throttle body be dirty? I didn't actually clean the throttle body, I just sprayed it for a few seconds with what I had left.
 

Last edited by blackbolt22; 10-17-2012 at 07:23 PM.
  #2  
Old 10-12-2012, 12:35 AM
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I would either check your grounds on the engine or add a temporary ground to it, roommate had a BMW 3 that had a bad ground, ran like crap until higher RPMs. How does the engine sound when this happens? Is it farting, sputtering, backfiring e.t.c.? Maybe check the MAP sensor as well, the ECU only checks this at startup to see what the baro pressure at the time is, then it switches over to load sensing with it.
 
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Old 10-12-2012, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by MazdaTirol
I would either check your grounds on the engine or add a temporary ground to it, roommate had a BMW 3 that had a bad ground, ran like crap until higher RPMs. How does the engine sound when this happens? Is it farting, sputtering, backfiring e.t.c.? Maybe check the MAP sensor as well, the ECU only checks this at startup to see what the baro pressure at the time is, then it switches over to load sensing with it.
No that's just it. It's not sputtering, or anything. It's just a complete loss of power. It's like the 1.5 Liter is turning into a .5 Liter. I feel or hear nothing out of the ordinary!!! It's literally like letting off the gas.

The map has been changed I think because there is an old one in the trunk. It's a little sensor with a plug connector and a vacuum line spout. How do I check it?

As far as ground I tightened up the ground when I removed it to reset the battery. It goes right over to the frame of the car and it's tight as well. Is there an ECU ground somewhere?

Remember this thing has full power when it clears up OR when I cycle the ignition on and off. I could have it floored and it be bogging and cycle it and bam it will jerk me back into my seat and go go go!!
 
  #4  
Old 10-12-2012, 08:55 AM
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You could just unhook the electrical connector on the MAP and see if that changes anything. Did you get your CE light checked yet?
 
  #5  
Old 10-12-2012, 04:26 PM
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blackbolt: these protege's are famous for cracked air intake hoses. Pull on it near the ribbed section and look for cracks in the valleys. Quick fix: Duct tape. It's the only proper use of duct tape.. but I digress.
 
  #6  
Old 10-13-2012, 09:20 AM
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It has an aftermarket solid intake hose with rubber sleeves, it's not leaking I checked.

I hooked my friends OBD II gadget to it that transfers data to my android phone so I can see live data. My 02s stay at 0 volts at idle but sometimes have voltage.

When I look at the fuel system widget it says "closed loop using fuel mix from 02" sometimes during idle or driving, but other times it says "open loop, system failure" Going to google this.
 

Last edited by blackbolt22; 10-13-2012 at 09:28 AM.
  #7  
Old 10-13-2012, 09:27 AM
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Looking up on wikipedia, these are the three codes the scantool shows during operation:

A1 Closed loop, using oxygen sensor feedback to determine fuel mix
A2 Open loop due to engine load OR fuel cut due to deceleration
A3 Open loop due to system failure


I reset the codes because I fixed the exhaust which had multiple leaks even before the O2 sensor and am waiting for all of the tests to complete before it triggers another code but it hasn't yet.
 
  #8  
Old 10-15-2012, 10:47 AM
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Me thinks the O2 sensor(s) may be faulty. There are ways to check them, after all they are not cheap.
Check electrical connections first , make sure there is air going to them from the outside.

If you take them out you can bench test them with a voltmeter and a torch.
 
  #9  
Old 10-15-2012, 04:35 PM
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Here Is what I've done since I posted:

Replaced distributor cap
Replaced spark plugs
Checked resistance on the cylinder that is missing

Yes. I think the issue is that cylinder three is misfiring. What happened was I noticed that a cylinder was missing with the ac on at low rpms. To confirm I held the brake at low rpm, about 1500, with the ac on and gave it gas. Since usually it clears up after it hits 2500 or so, this time it didn't and what I saw was the check engine light blink!! Then I let off and it threw a code that said 0203 which is cyl three. This prompted me to change the above.

That being said cyl three is still misfiring under heavy load and low rpms but has full power at high rpms
 
  #10  
Old 10-15-2012, 04:37 PM
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What else can it be?? If cyl three misses at low rpms and heavy load, despite new expensive plugs, good wires, and new cap and rotors, ..... Injector???
 


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