Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

I post this on mazdaworld.org as well. I hope no one minds the double post if they read both boards. I know babyhuey and kenninn are the resident Millenia brains here so I figured it couldnt hurt.

I started pulling a P0302 CEL again today and I guess its Cylinder #2 misfiring. This is the same one that was misfiring on me a few months ago. After reading some posts here I get the impression that I might have a bad coil pack and or oil fouling the coil pack/plug. I was thinking about swapping coil pack #2 with coil pack #4 and seeing if the CEL misfire follows the coil pack or not.

Just a little history, I have a 1996 Mazda Millenia S. Seems pretty straight forward for removal though, just a take off a few nuts and make sure not to damage the metal seals. I was wondering if there was a torque spec for when I put the nuts back on or just "snug them up" so that they will not move or crush the metal gasket. Any advice would be appreciated.

On a side note I guess also from searching here the coil packs for the 95-97 Millenia S is different from the 98+ Millenia S. Anyone out there with a reasonably priced used coil pack for a 95-97 Millenia S? ;)

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Hadrien, Just snug up the bolts. Spec is 14-19 lb/ft with a new gasket but if you are trying a fix then just get them close. Good check to see if is the coil pack or not. Might also swap the #2 plug with #6 just to see if problem moves to #6 at that point. Will look into the MY difference in the coils and see if I can find you a good used.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Thank you so much babyhuey! I will just snug it up tight for now. I think the mechanic said last time that the reason I was getting a misfire on cylinder 2 was because they found some oil in the plug well and it was causing the misfire. I have a nagging feeling the same thing applies this time, but rather than pay $100 for them to clean it out for me I will take a stab at it myself.

The car is running fine today, it only seems to run rough on wet mornings or really really cold mornings. I am "sneaking" the Millenia into garage parking spot in my apt complex to try to keep her dry until I can get under the hood. I will check back about the used coil pack.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Did not have a good used in my stash of parts but looked into difference between years. Very earliest production ( before 10/1/94 ) has a coil part #KJ01-18-100A. After that all Millenia S use the same coil with part #KJ01-18-100C up to end of production in 2002. In 1999 the connecting boot and spring were made available separately from the coil but to buy the entire coil as an assembly is still the same part # and price $174.80 retail.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Is that a price from a website or is that the price that it should be roughly from my local mazda dealer?

Also, any tips on taking the coil pack out? Looks like its just 2 screws and you twist it out? Sound about right?

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

That is retail at dealer. Looks like you can get from onlinemazdaparts for $139.84.

You got it for removing. Just those two phillips or 8mm screws, give a little twist to release boot from plug and pull straight out.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

And if I find oil in the spark plug well that means my Valve Cover gaskets are leaking correct? Something I know is not doable by myself.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Yes that would mean your valve cover gasket is leaking if oil is inside the spark plug well. It is certainly do-able by yourself expecially if it is only the left bank valve cover gasket. If you have the means to remove the intercooler then is not a whole lot different to remove the valve cover and install a new gasket. Will only require the use of a ratchet, extension, 10 mm socket, new gasket, and a small tube off silicone sealer to complete the repair.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Well I could br wrong about the front intercooler. But on the 96 it seems a little different than the 98+ years. It looks like it is just 4 bolts and the cooler pops right off. I dont have a service manual, I am just going on visual observations. Hopefully I am right as I am always a bit apprehensive about cranking into and engine that I know is a bit tempermental.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

No you are not wrong about the front intercooler. It will just pop off when the 4 bolts/nuts are removed. The valve cover will follow the same exact idea though. Just a few more bolts that are only 10mm.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Still havent had a chance to take the front intercooler off yet to inspect the coil packs. Got the CEL again two days ago. Pulled out of my parking spot today and see a 3ft by 3.5ft patch of oil underneath my car. I pretty much got that jumping heart feeling when I saw it.

Drove the car about 70 miles last night , so I am hoping I didnt mess anything up. Last night I ran my car for a few minutes in that spot while I was unpacking it. I can only think this is when the oil dumping happened. This morning, I topped the car off and drove to work, no problems, noises, smells, etc. ( I didnt WANT to drive it, but its a 5 mile drive to work and I had no choice in transportation )

I cant imagine that a Valve Cover Gasket leak could be THAT bad and the car would still run like it did last night. Maybe I hit something on the highway and nicked the oil pan. Can anyone else think of anything else I should look for, I am going to get under the car this weekend and inspect the filter, and drain plug area, other than that I dont know where to look. If it helps it look like a large portion of the oil came more from the passenger side of the car. Thanks in advance!

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

WOW. first off, are you SURE it is engine oil? on the ground, coolant, oil, and trans fluid can look similar. that big a puddle cannot be the valve cover leak, unless it is off. for that much, it is being PUMPED out, as the motor is running. with that big of a leak, you would be out of oil real quick. how much did you add?
if for sure it is oil, i would check the "sandwich" oil cooler/heater. this goes between the oil filter and the oil filter head, and has coolant running thru it. there is an o ring seal, and over time and many heat cycles, the seal becomes hard and shrinks. the cooler/heater comes loose, and it can make the oil filter back off. this is a huge problem on the mitsubishi's, dunno about the mazda, but it is the exact same design. if it is the cooler, there is a large threaded fitting that runs thru it, and you CANNOT overtorque that rascal, or you will crush the cooler, then oil and coolant will mix inside the motor, and fubar it.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

I am fairly sure it was engine oil. I dabbed my finger in it and it was dark, brown, and smelled alot like engine oil that you would smell on the end of the dipstick. Not to mention I added about 1.5 quarts to get it almost to full. I didnt want to add anymore for risk of overfilling it. I agree the spot was VERY large and I am thinking something like I hit something on the road that scraped the oil pan and or filter. I will do my best to check in that area you described keninn. I am no mechanic, but am learning more and more as I have more and more problems with the Millenia.

I'm pretty ready to give up on the car at this point. I like it, but I dont like all of the "uniqueness" about it. Plus Im jonzing for a manual sedan again after I picked myself up a '92 MX3 last weekend. Im putting the car up on a lift this Sunday and will post what I find. Im apprehensive at this point.

EDIT: I also forgot to mention, the same night that I drove the car like 70 miles, the "TCS ON" and "TCS/OFF" lights came on while I was on the toll road. Normally I would have pulled over and stopped the car, but there were no exits. I dont know if that helps "describe the problem". Im still boggled why it dumped that much oil.

I drove the car again today abotu 20 miles to and from lunch and no problems. If I had a cracked block or blown head gasket I would imagine I would know pretty quickly even with a short trip like that and that it would be spewing oil every where each time I drove.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Well I dug into the car today. Took off the front intercooler and changed the oil. There was a decent amount of oil in Cylinder #2 where I was getting the misfire. I cleaned off the coil pack and got a qtip in there and cleaned out the small pool of oil that was at the bottom of the cylinder where the top of the spark plug was. It actually took about 4 qtips to get it all out and even then I could see a fine film left. Per babyhuey's idea I swapped the coil pack on 2 with the coil pack on 6 to see if the misfire follows.

Much to my dismay though I found a significant amout of oil in the front intercooler as well as in the pipe that goes from the intercooler to the intake. From all of my research this means that my superchargers seals are going bad? Just figured I would update the thread. Thanks again guys for all the help! :)

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

personally, i think that oil in the intercooler stuff is normal. you will notice that the ones that post that the seals in the compressor are bad know very little about cars. you will get oil mist from a lot of places, especially the pcv valve. since it routes the excess "air" back thru the intake(sealed system), the oil mist then cools, and forms a film, then small puddles in the intake path. this is normal. on the mitsu, oil in the intake was not taken as a bad turbo, but a normal operating phenomena, and we would take the intake tract apart and clean it from time to time. cars with egr seems to be somewhat worse. bmw's have some fairly sophisticated systems to try to "catch" the condensed oil mist, and route the oil back to the sump. they dont work, but they are there. some of the bmw's have to have the intake plenum and all associated parts removed and cleaned, it is so bad. we have seen cars come in on a hook with oil coming out the tailpipe. also, oil in the plug wells throwing a misfire code is common on bmw's with cop system. modern day engines are a sealed system, if it dont go out the exhaust, it gets routed back thru the intake for another try. btw, when was the last time the plugs were changed?

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

I changed out the plugs about 3 months ago. I had to have the knock sensor replaced, and not too soon after that was when I started to get the misfire on Cylinder #2. I'll be driving her back and forth to work the next few days, still nervous about taking her on a long trip home to Cincinnati for Xmas. Dont really want her to dump all the engine oil on the interstate.

I looked around the best I could today. Friend of mine has a pit in his garage so I was able to get under the car and really ahve a good look. There was engine oil EVERYWHERE on the underside of the car. It was all over the oil pan, what looked like part of the AC Compressor, and most of the chassis back from the oil pan. As well as the driver side inner CV boot. I was hoping the leak would be obvious but I was clueless. I cleaned up everything the best I could with some engine cleaner spray he had and wiped everything else down with a rag.

Gonna give it a week and put it back in his garage and see if we can find where the leak or as I like to call it "dumping" occured. If I had a guess of where it started it was somewhere in the upper passenger side of the engine. Sadly I dont know what to look for in that area. The was definately no leakage from the oil filter or from the oil drain plug. It "kinda" looked like there was oil seepage around the edge of the oil pan where it meets the engine but that doesnt explain how oil got on the ac compressor.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Hadrien, I was thinking maybe from the oil sender unit but that would have been right above the oil filter I think so you would have seen it when changing the filter. Are any drips noticed with engine just sitting and idling that could be followed? Was oil all over the A/C compressor or just on bottom?

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

I drove about 20 miles tonight so the car was nice and warm. Once I got it home I parked it and let it idle. I dug a piece of cardboard out of the garbage and set it under the car about 5 inches in from the center of the passenger side front wheel. I sat there on my stomach and waited, and I didnt have to wait long. There was a drip about every 3-5 seconds from that area.

It could be that part you are describing since I know the filter is more to the passenger side of the car. I dont know what that part looks like or where to look for it near the oil filter however. Any hints on what it might look like in general? IF the oil were dripping straight down (which I know is near impossible) if you look down from the top of the engine right around where the oil dip stick is, in that general area is where the oil drippings are collecting underneath the car. I know this seems vague. The oil seemed to be only on the bottom of the AC Compressor. Like I said I can only assume it was the AC Compressor since it looked like a high pressure hose was comign out of it. If you were under the car and facing forward like you were driving the "AC Compressor" I am describing would be about 3 o'clock to the oil filter and ahead of it.

If I get to get it over my friends pit again, would removing the plastic guards by the oil filter and oil pan help you think? After seeing the leak again tonight I know now I am NOT taking it on a 700 mile round trip to Cincinnati for Xmas. The new MX3 will have to make that trip.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Hadrien, it definitely sounds like the oil pressure sender is leaking. It is located just above where your oil filter is and just to the drivers side of the A/C compressor. Took me a minute to get the 3 o'clock ahead of the filter thing.:D. Am posting quick cause I see you are online so may get this right away. Will get a diagram of the sender location that may help. Hold on.
Am having the devil of a time posting tonight as it keeps kicking me out and saying feature disabled and have to log out and back in.
Must be my connection or computer as I cannot get to Mazda manuals online to post you a pic of the location. It should be just above the oil filter. Is a single wire connector that is right above where the oil filter is located. Will see if I can post you again in the morning a pic that will explain better. it is the only thing around that area that should leak in the volume that you describe.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Sorry for the weird description babyhuey. It was the best way I could describe it though hehe. :P The car dumped another decent amount of oil last night. I had to do some holiday driving around town and this morning the piece of cardboard I left under the car to watch the drips last night was totally soaked in oil. It definately seems to drip more when the car has been nice and warmed up than it does if I just take it to and from work (6 mile trip 1 way)

I cant thank you enough for any info you can post on the oil pressure sending unit. I guess the biggest question is, is it a repair that needs to be done by an experienced mechanic, or possibly something I could attempt. Thanks in advance! :D



EDIT: Did some searching. Is this the part your are referring to babyhuey?


http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductD...pe=417&ptset=A

I will try to get the car up before the holiday to check if that is indeed the part. I also assume I have to drain the oil again to swap out the part :P

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

If it is the oil pressure sender then you should be able to replace by yourself. OE part would need a 24mm wrench or deep socket but could also just use an adjustable wrench as it is not tight. Pic at bottom of page will give you a better idea of location. The link to the part looks to be the right one. OE part is B367-18-501. Retails for $20.90. Also at www.onlinemazdaparts.com for $17.77.
May be leaking more at higher rpm and warm due to increase of oil pressure and thinning of oil. Take a look at it and see if that is the source. :D

[IMG]local://upfiles/1377/98AA01AD462444C3A9BA8BA17C405649.gif[/IMG]

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Awesome awesome info! I will see if I can pop it on the pit Saturday but doubt I will be able to. Looking at the diagram now I can see that it would be replaceable at least by a friend of mine if not me. Should I wrap the threads with teflon tape piror to replacing the Oil Pressure switch, assuming that is where the leak is?

Would you recommend me getting the part from the local mazda dealer or would an Auto Zone or Advanced Auto Parts type place be ok?

I know I truly appreciate all your hard work and posting on the board babyhuey, I just hope everyone else does as well!

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Thanks Hadrien, I appreciate that.

Given that the price is almost identical, I would use the Mazda part but an aftermarket would work just fine I am sure. Lots of times the switch will come with a sealer on the threads already but if the threads are just bare metal then a few wraps with teflon thread tape is highly recommended. The factory one does not have the sealer as I looked this morning. We actually had one in stock!!!
Sure hope that is the source of your leakage. It is the cheapest and easiest oil leak to fix.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

I too hope that is the source. My only concern is that the first time I got under the car to look for the leak and do an oil change, there was almost no oil on or around the filter. It looks like this part sits right above the filter. If it was dripping I would think it would run down the filter as well as other parts. I guess maybe if it was spurting I could see it hitting the bottom of the AC Compressor. We will all find out soon enough! :P Gonna try to get under the car before the holiday.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Got the CEL flashing again today. Car has been running really rough on startup the last 2 days with it being so wet. Took the car to AutoZone and it came up with a P0306, misfire on cylinder 6. So it looks like the misfire followed the coil pack. Its good and bad. Good because now I know why it runs rough. Bad because I am worried that if cylinder 2 is leaking oil, it will continue to foul coil packs. But at least now I know, without babyhuey's advice I wouldnt have had the confidence to swap coil packs myself. Thanks babyhuey!

On a side note I ordered a used coil pack fom a guy on the web to save a few bucks and see how it goes. $50 is alot less than $160. *crosses fingers on it working*

Getting under the car sometime Saturday to search for the oil leak. The guy I got the coil pack from mentioned I should take the timing belt plastic cover off and look for leaks coming from some copper plugs there as well, which I will try to do.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Got under the car today and unfortunately the source of the oil is not the oil pressure switch. Its somewhere on the side or the back of the engine. I took off the splash shield and looked and looked and looked, but could NOT find the source of the leak. Im just going to have to offload the car onto a used car lot or something.

The car leaked something fierce onto my friends pit, but I couldn't find the source of the leak. If I had to guess again where it was coming from I would be inclined to say somewhere near the rear bank timing belt cover area. There are somewhat look to be vaccuum hoses with silver shielding on them, its almost like fine ridged metalic split loom. Its covered in oil and everything below that as well is covered in oil.

Also, under the oil cap and around the PCV valve there was thick almost greasy "oil", I noticed JUST a hint of it at the end of the dip stick as well. My friend who's garage I was working in said not to worry about it that it was condensation or something, but I have NEVER seen anything like that in the 18 months I have owned the car. I was very nervous about coolant causing the oil to foam up, took a sample from the coolant tank and found no signs of oil in the coolant. So I have NO idea what that is.

On a side note the coilpack works great and hopefully will solve the misfire problem for me for the few more weeks of owning the car.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Sorry to hear you wanting to get rid of the car Hadrien. Only thing I can think of in the area you are describing would be a valve cover gasket which should not leak that badly or a front cam seal or plug on the right bank. That would put the leak to the rear area up high and if the intake cam plug was popping out a bit then would leak badly. Only problem is that a leak from the cam seal or plug usually stays fairly contained in timing covers untill it get to the bottom and runs out. Wish I could take a look at it for you.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

I wish I could keep the car, but my gut is screaming at me that something is wrong. I am just frustrated since I was inable to find the leak. Should be something simple and straightforward. However, even if I had found the leak, it is now sounding like I would be unable to fix it myself and I cant see sinking another $1000+ into the car which might have ANOTHER major poblem in 6 months. I owe twice what the car is worth right now.

My biggest concern on top of the leak is the foamy or mousse like oil under the cap and PCV valve that I keep finding. And I noticed the last few times I checked the oil that afterwards my finger smelled slightly of gasoline.

RE: Torque spec on front intercooler 96 Millenia S - CEL P0302
 

Well sorry to say this will be my last week with the Millenia S. Its been a fun trip, but too many problems have caused me to trader her in. I have been wanting a manual transmission car for about 6 months anyway. If ONLY they would have made the Millenia with a 5SP I would think about fixing the numerous problems with her, or even just replacing the engine. No other car I have driven in that price range has the feeling and just overall solid composure that the Millenia has. Acura, BMWs, Audi, VW's comparable sedans are all indeed quite nice, but no where NEAR the price range that the Millenia is in.

Just wanted to say thank you again to babyhuey and keninn for all of your help. Babyhuey, you saved me hundreds of dollars in diagnostic fees I normally would have paid. Thank you thank you thank you.